Podcast

Transcript

Joshua Miller (00:00)

Everyone, welcome back to another episode of the 5 in 20 podcast by Remarkable Academic Foods. I'm your host Joshua Miller, where we have another five or so questions in 20 something minutes. And today's topic is on guest experience with our friend Barbara Khozam. She is a customer experience keynote speaker known around the world for her impactful, high energy delivery, outrageous wit and ability to connect with her audience. She has spoken more than 1,700 times to more than 75,000 people in 12 countries about customer service, leadership, motivation, and communication, all of which we can say we thrive off of in school food service. So make sure you stick around for the value that's about to be dropped in this episode.

All right, Barbara, thank you for taking the time to join us here and talking about customer experience. To kick things off, let people get to know you a little bit better. You've been to 12 different countries at least. So what is your guilty pleasure food? 

Barbara Khozam (01:03)

Oh my gosh, Josh. Guilty pleasure. Okay, so this is kind of embarrassing, but I like this. This is so stupid. I like this. It's not popcorn and it's not like a cheese puff.

But it's kind of in between. It's like called a white cheddar puff or something. I don't know. I love these things. Like I can't open a bag and eat a couple. Like the whole thing is gone. Oh, it's great. 

Joshua Miller (01.03)

You’ve got to let me know what that... I've never had that before. It sounds interesting though, for sure. 

Barbara Khozam (01:37)

Oh yeah, for sure. It's like Pirate's Booty. 

Joshua Miller (01:42)

Oh, okay. I know exactly what you're talking about. Yeah, there we go. Those are good. Those are definitely good. Awesome.

Well, here today we're talking about customer experience, which in school food service can often be interpreted as guest experience or student experience because they really are a guest. You know, they don't have to come in and eat the food. They can bring food from home and they really just don't like anyone's food. They could just not eat at all, go hungry, unfortunately. But, you know, it really is a guest experience. And you believe that guest experience or I should ask you, do you believe it's like a universal language? I've been looking at it the different industries that you spoken with everything from hospitals to big fast food chain. And it really got me thinking like it is a part of almost every business, right? 

Barbara Khozam (02:29)

Yeah, it sure is. But what, uh, what's common to one person is not to another, you know, and like some, something simple like smiling does not come naturally to a lot of people.

You know, like my relaxed face, like when I'm relaxed, I mean, like if you look better right now, I ask the audience, like if I do a presentation, I go, my face is relaxed. What do I look like? And a lot of people will say you look old. I'm like, you know, that's rude. That's really rude. But I look mad. Like a lot of people, when our face is relaxed, we look mad. Well, that's the first impression that we're giving people. But if we could slap a smile on our face, we could instantly change that first impression, which can change that entire experience. I mean, something simple like that, a lot of people don't realize, you know? 

Joshua Miller (03:19)

Yeah. There's the, what's those initials? I don't want to say it out loud, but RBF. 

Barbara Khozam (03:27)

Oh yeah. I call it grumpy face syndrome. GFS. Yes. 

Joshua Miller (03:31)

So where does excellent guest experience start with an organization? So some schools, they're doing their own food service. Sometimes they hire a company to provide it, but every, no matter what, it's an organization in some way, shape or form providing it. Where does excellent guest experience start with every organization? 

Barbara Khozam (03:51)

Well, in my opinion, it starts at the top of the organization. So the owner of the company depends on, you know, big companies, owners and leaders. They set the tone for how employees interact. If a leader doesn't say good morning to an employee when they walk in, why would an employee say good morning to a guest? You know, so it starts at the top. I firmly believe that, but then it also goes back to structure. Do we have a workflow around customer service? Because just like we said before, like the behaviors, if I don't know what behavior to do, I'm not going to do it.

For example, wearing a name badge. That's a customer service behavior that we can all be consistent with. But if we're not clear on what behaviors I need someone to do and we don't have it written down and we have, what is it called? 

Joshua Miller (03:59)

Standard operating procedures. 

Barbara Khozam (04:00)

Agreement from everyone, right? 

Joshua Miller (04:56)

Yeah. Then we can't get consistency from everyone over time. Yeah, that's so true. And depending on the culture of that kitchen, it could differ vastly. So, you know, obviously in the South hospitality, so coming in and making sure, especially if you're a leader, that you're saying hi to all the team members. But believe it or not, even in Philadelphia, there's a big hospital there. And if you don't go in and say hi to every single person and you ask them to do something later on, you would get some attitude. So I was coached on that before I started working there because they were like, it is huge here. Make sure you go in here and you are respectful and happy in the morning saying hi to everyone. So I believe that 100%. And so in terms having policies in place and all that, but even just not necessarily by policy, recognizing team members that are succeeding in it. So recognize reward and praise. You believe that's a key to impact.  Why is that? 

Barbara Khozam (05:58)

Josh it's so important I feel like you're in my head I'm like yeah exactly and you know it's really sad because we, we recognize the bad stuff like that's super easy…you're late and where's your name badge…yeah why can't we also recognize the positive stuff! Every human being on this planet wants and needs acknowledgement. Everyone wants recognition. We don't do it. We don't do it half as much. I mean, we should be giving nine positives for every negative. Leaders need to document when and to whom they're giving positive feedback to. And it doesn't have to be like a super extraordinary thing. It could be, hey, Josh, oh my gosh, you remembered that patient, that customer, the student's name? And you use that student's name when they came in. Oh my gosh. Did you see their face light up? Awesome. Thanks so much, Josh. I mean, this is easy stuff, right? But I don't think we do it enough. So thanks for reminding me. 

Joshua Miller (07:05)

Yeah, but there's a great opportunity for that. So I'm a huge, huge fan of pre -shift huddles where everyone comes together for the AM shift and then again for the PM shift and you're covering topics, anything from what happened yesterday to what to expect today and what's on the menu. Those are key moments where you have everyone's attention. And again, yes, you have things to correct, but those are also an opportunity to talk about those successes, whether it's individually or as a team. So I believe that 100 % is huge. 

Barbara Khozam (07:37)

Absolutely. And Josh, I got to tell you about those, those, what did you call them? Huddles? 

Joshua Miller (07:37)

Yeah. Huddles. 

Barbara Khozam (07:37)

Okay. So one of the top three motivators of employees is feeling in on things. And that's what those huddles do, right? They know what's going on. They know who's coming in, what food we got, but like that makes them feel a part of the team. And that's a huge motivator for a lot of people. 

Joshua Miller (08:04)

So I love that. Absolutely. And sometimes I've had to, let's say coach a little bit. So, you know, shows can be very aggressive and very matter of fact. And, uh, you know, just having to tell them, Hey, it doesn't have to be all about procedures and do this or do that. Throw in some of those positive vibes because that way that they're going to leave that pre -shift huddle is going to impact your service. Now that's right. It's pre -shift before the big rush comes in. Are they going to be in a positive mood or not? So great. I agree. And you believe nonverbal communication, you can build that in seconds, not minutes, which I think is, is big because for, you know, and it's a unique situation in the restaurant. Cooks can be behind the scenes.They're not customer facing and in that direct contact with them. But in school food service, especially as design trends continue to push forward to doing more cooking out front in front of the customer. Now that person that is your cook, that might be a little rough around the edges. They are not like a face. They're a face of your food service team and customer service might not necessarily be the top of their strengths. So where does nonverbal communication come into with these scenarios? 

Barbara Khozam (09:28)

Well, nonverbals are everything, right? How does that saying go? It's not what you say. It's how you say it, right? It's not. So communication is not the words. It's everything else. Our body, like, like, if I come into work and I'm kind of having a bad day, right? Well, my body language is automatically negative, right? Like I'm, I'm slouched over. I got like the ugly face, you know, and I'm like, and people don't have to look at me and they're like, uh -oh, you know, you drop your smile, you know, that kind of crap. Oh, sorry about my language. But if we can get our body to be positive, seriously, like if we physically.

If we can stand up straight, we can slap a smile on our face. When we get our body to be positive, we can change our thought process and we'll communicate. Everything will be more positive. So the point is we need to be more conscious of our nonverbals. Cause I know like, you know, when you're working away, you know, you're cooking, you know, you're probably slouched down a little bit, right? Focused, you know, I got the serious look, but that could be scary for some people, right? So if we're conscious of it, we can change these things. 

Joshua Miller (10:41)

Yeah. And that's something that I’m definitely known for, I'm like in this, everyone called it “in the zone for me” where I'm just like, there's no happy face. I'm just in the zone. I'm so focused and I had to learn throughout my career to be able to turn that switch on to look a little bit more approachable if you may, because that was unfortunately the reputation I had for a lot of people when they first meet me is, oh, he's not approachable. And it's like, no, I'm just very focused. And over time they get to understand like, oh no, he's just, he's in his zone and he's totally approachable now. So, for some it comes easier in terms of, you know, people in school, food service that are out front. You, I feel like every school has that one or two person, people that are, I would call “food service famous”, right? Where like all the students know their name. They go up to them and it's just like this exchange that it's like they're literally like family. And, and it's because they just built that rapport over time, not only starting with the nonverbal, but also the verbal communication. So I think that's, that's key as well. I'm assuming your tone of voice plays a big part of that too, right? 

Barbara Khozam (11:49)

Oh, of course. Yeah. Yeah. Good point, Josh. 

Joshua Miller (11:59)

Yeah. So again, it's high pressure. We're cooking, we're out front, there's 15 different things to do in 15 places in 15 seconds. There's a lot to do under pressure. And so what does it take to manage emotions and thrive in those pressure situations? 

Barbara Khozam (12:20)

Oh, gosh, yes. Well, I think, first of all, it's being aware, when you're getting out of control. Like what are your physiological symptoms if you're starting to kind of lose it, right? Because when we get angry or upset, adrenaline increases, right? So heart rate, and like for me, I start sweating, my face turns bright red, but I can feel it. And so I call it hitting the pause button. So when I feel like the heat, you know, I can feel the heat like, uh -oh, uh -oh. Then I need to hit the pause button. What is that? Is it counting to 10? Is it drinking water? Is it taking a quick break? Is it leaving the room? But it's hitting the pause button so you can lower the adrenaline, lower the cortisol, so you can come back and be more effective, more calm. So it's really about being aware of it and then doing something about it. Yeah, I believe that.

Joshua Miller (13:21)

100%. And especially if you're a leader, recognizing that with your team, you get to know their personality over time and you can sense when they're not in a good mood. And sometimes that one person has such an impact on the kitchen that if they are in a bad mood, it spreads to everyone. I've seen it and it is not pretty. So from the leadership aspect, recognizing when that is happening and just, again, it's not you, but it's them in a state where they're...They're getting up there and you just let them walk away, take a deep breath for a few seconds and hopefully come back in a better mood because of that... Right? 

Barbara Khozam (14:00)

Yeah. And you just, you just made a good point is sometimes you need like a buddy system. Like I may, maybe I don't realize I'm like, uh, anti -barb, you know? And so I might have a coworker, they go “barb, barb, barb…take a break”. I got it. You know, go, go outside for fun. So sometimes you need help to recognize so you can get back in control. And that's okay too, right? 

Joshua Miller (14:24)

Absolutely. And I can't remember where I came across as it was probably like a poster or something. And it was basically saying like for every pre -shift huddle going back to those moments, you know, just taking the temperature gauge of the kitchen where everyone there can say how they're feeling. And I think it was something very simple, like in my, like, you know, like the doneness of a steak in my medium and my medium well, my well done, like, where are you on that scale? I can go down a whole nother rabbit hole of not only is this key for making sure that from the top down, you have excellent customer experience, guest experience, but also that mental health aspect. You know, that's, that's definitely a key aspect of that checking the pulse. And I want to talk about a C word here. So usually the C word for me is collaboration. I love using that word, but we want to talk about complaints. And complaints in school food service are inevitable. Anyone that works in it, it is impossible to please every student. It's impossible to please every student's parent because they literally are an extension of that guest. They advocate for them. And that's through college in some instances where you're having to feel those complaints and those concerns because they're becoming more educated. It's not just about “is the quality of the food good”. It's not just about that. It's also the health aspect of it. You know, what kind of ingredients are you using? Where is it coming from? So it's inevitably impossible to please everyone. So you're going to have those complaints. Why can guest complaints be your greatest opportunity? 

Barbara Khozam (16:06)

Hmm…Well, if they're not complaining, then what are they doing? Going somewhere else. So I want people to complain because at least they're communicating. They're letting, like it's an opportunity. I can go, oh my gosh, I didn't realize that was a problem. Let's talk about it. Here's some options, you know, here's some options that can help. So it's if, if people don't complain, I'm not going to ever improve. So we can turn it into an opportunity, but the key is really how you respond to the complaint, I think can make or break it. Right. Am I going to make an excuse, oh, oh, you want gluten free? It's over there. You know, like, am I going to do that? Or am I going to acknowledge, oh my gosh, yeah, I see that you want gluten free. Well, you're in the pasta line. Yeah. Yeah. So we've got five other gluten free stations that are over here. So if you acknowledge the complaint, like what a lot of people do, is someone will complain, oh, this stuff isn't gluten free. And you'll be like, it's over there. Right? But if I acknowledge, oh, okay, I understand that you're looking for gluten free. Okay, I see that. Well, we've got 35 other stations other than the pasta bar that is gluten free. So you might want to try one of those. Yay. Okay. It's like acknowledge and then give options. You could turn around a lot of these. 

Joshua Miller (17:32)

I love that. Love that. Definitely acknowledging. And so, and you know, the complaint is almost like in some instances where we want the complaints in school food service. So we're actually, you know, the technology is coming out to where we can get real time feedback from students and we're making it easier for them where it could be a text, it could be a scanning, a QR code, it could be a link in an email. We're just making it easier and easier and easier for them to give us that feedback. And we do want the positive with the negative because that's how we make improvements and that's how we gauge where we are. And I think that...that technology is just going to continue to be a huge aspect in this realm just because it's a critical component. Actually, I just found out about one where it's actually public. Not only the technology where the students can send feedback. So normally you have like a paper and pen or paper and pencil comic card and they fill it out and they stuff it in a box. Now there's technology where it could be on a screen, on a digital screen, and they could send their message electronically from their phone and exactly what they said, post in real time on that digital screen. And, and the foodservice director or manager or whoever can respond to that. And you can actually see the responses in real time. Yeah. It's crazy. Actually, I love that. Yes, yes. So I see where you're saying about the…the complaints can be a great opportunity. And I think that shift is definitely happening in the industry where we're more open to that. So is there anything else that you want to share with the audience in terms of, you know, any tips or anything like that in terms of shifting culture or just, just helping them understand the guest experience is such a key part of keeping students happy? 

Barbara Khozam (19:37)

Well, it's just…just, I think it's just like what we already said is that customer or guest experience. It's, it's easy. It's, it's easy. You know, it's not like, Oh, I need a new software program. No, it's what being respectful and it's because I don't have to like every student that comes in. I don't have to agree with them, but I can be kind. I can be respectful and this is of each other. This is of employees. This is of guests. So I think if we all just took it out of like, it's not personal. They're not, not about me. It's about being kind. It's about being respectful. That is extremely contagious. I think if we just focus on that, that would, that we'll have world peace, Josh. 

Joshua Miller (20:25)

I definitely think that changing the…the rhetoric around it with leaders, top down, as you said earlier on, right? That's a huge thing of acknowledging, right? First acknowledging that it's a big aspect of it and making sure that it becomes a part of the identity, taking care of the team first, and they're going to take care of the students second. 

So Barbara, one last question for the audience. Where can people connect, go to connect with you and learn more about what you're doing or, you know, figure out how to get maybe even a speaking engagement? 

Barbara Khozam (21:01)

Right. Yes, they can simply go to my website. I'm very complicated. It's BarbaraKhozam.com. My name, I'm sure you'll put it in the notes. LinkedIn. I'm also on LinkedIn. Those are two of my two favorite places. So reach out. I'm here. 

Joshua Miller (21:18)

All right. Awesome. And again, everyone, thank you for tuning in for this episode. You are all remarkable academic food ambassadors, including Barbara for giving us some great value to take to the school food service role where maybe you already had it all down pat or maybe you just needed a little refresher and she's helping you reevaluate your current situation. So thank you again, everyone, for everything that you're doing. Thank you, Barbara. And everyone, until next time, I'm your host, signing off.